Monday, August 25, 2008

Boston and Chicago Are Now States

In all seriousness, I really do admire Hillary Clinton, and I think she would have made a wonderful president, that she would have made a great vice-president, and that she is a very good surrogate. I think she handles herself very well here, and with aplomb.

My only question is how does she hear the reporters' questions? I certainly can't. I don't know what she "never said", and I don't even know if she's answering the questions being asked of her!


mikhailbakunin said...

I will never understand why you respect this horrible woman.

She hasn't handled herself well at all! In fact, she's managed to be ALMOST as phony and self-gratifying as her philandering asshole husband. She spits venom and her supporters insist that she's being magnanimous. She kisses her own ass and they applaud her pluck.

Her speeches are filled with backhanded compliments toward Obama, and self-serving pseudo-feminist bullshit.

petpluto said...

I will never understand why you hate her so much. Her speech here was full of actual compliments to Obama and was filled with actual degradations of McCain. She fought an incredibly hard campaign, and has now put aside all that she wanted to do and accomplish for the greater good of a party that couldn't be bothered to step out and point out the sexist trope that was being flung at her throughout the campaign season.

And I don't see anything self-serving in this particular moment. Nor do I see her as phony overall. Obviously I don't know her personally, but neither do most of the people claiming she's Satan incarnate.

petpluto said...

Also, as a feminist myself her ACTUAL feminist messages are things I take as pretty damn cool. As opposed to some of the missteps Obama has made once he clinched the nomination in terms of what he's said about women's rights and reproductive health.

mikhailbakunin said...

Obama's missteps on reproductive health? He's far more liberal on the subject than any mainstream politician I know, including Clinton. He's one of the few Senators who opposed the wholesale ban on partial-birth abortion.

This post by Andrew Sullivan pretty much sums up my feeling on the feminist issue.

petpluto said...

Yes, his missteps in his speech on reproductive health, including derisively calling into question mental health of the mother as a rightful reason for obtaining an abortion. I'm not talking about voting records -in which is is a 98% to Clinton's 93%- but what he's been saying on the campaign trail. And I accept it, because I know he's playing a political game. But I do think that he has caused some hard feelings among feminists -in fact, I know so because I read their writing on a continuous basis.

And excuse me for saying so, but I take what Andrew Sullivan says about Hillary Clinton with a grain of salt, since during the primary season he was one of the people who most offended my own personal feminist sensibilities in his commentary on her.

mikhailbakunin said...

Really? You didn't think his arguments were at all compelling?

Did he offended your feminist sensibilities simply because he attacked a female leader? Sure, he said nasty things about her, but he's said far nastier things about her husband.

Can we not attack the Israeli government without being anti-Semitic?

petpluto said...

Oh, friggin' hell, Jer. Seriously now, do you think I'm so overly emotional and have no sense of logic or reason that I'm going to dislike a man simply because he attacks a female leader?

No, I don't think he makes good points about Hillary Clinton. I think his points about what Hillary did to "set back" feminism are wishy washy and then turn to absolute BULL when he invokes the tears of femininity.

You know what? Being a woman and a feminist doesn't mean my street cred when I disagree with political commentary dries up, or that I'm disagreeing based solely on the fact that I'm a woman and a feminist -or that if it does stem from my feminism that I am wrong.

And don't you fucking dare compare disliking what Andrew Sullivan said about Hillary Clinton and finding some of it baseless and some of the other stuff tasteless and just flat out wrong to accusing someone of anti-Semitic behavior for disagreeing with Israel's policies. I didn't say he was a misogynist; I didn't say he was evil; I said I disliked what he said and that he was wrong.

And really now, "he's said far nastier things about her husband"? That's one of your selling points? Yippie! He wasn't quite as much as an asshole as he could have been! Let me get the confetti.

mikhailbakunin said...

Of course I don't think that you're an illogical knee-jerk feminist.

But I'm curious what Sullivan said that offended your "feminist sensibilities," and why you think has arguments are baseless.

It seemed like you were charging him with sexism.

petpluto said...

Well, yeah. I think he made sexist comments. That doesn't mean I think he is a sexist; just that he made sexist comments. Go watch Jay Smooth's video on how to combat racism ( That is how I try to combat sexism.

I just posted about this, so go read that if you want to know some of what I like about Hillary Clinton and why I dislike that article by Andrew Sullivan that you linked.

John said...

Wow, okay.

Since you are of the opinion that Hillary Clinton would have made a great president or vice-president, I'd like to know whether or not you think she should be appointed to the Supreme Court. Obama may have the opportunity to make it happen, after all. Do you think she has what it takes?

petpluto said...

Actually, I think I would like for her to remain in the Senate. I do think she's done a tremendous job there so far; she has been able to make concessions without compromising her values, and she could become a star player in the Senate. I would like her in a place where she enacts new policy, instead of being in a place where she just reviewed whether or not laws and policies were Constitutional.